that’s a good one @ksub 
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can’t help but agree.
very well said my friend!
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At this point, I’m more inclined to sunset Stark. What’s happened is that a perfectly good title has been ruined because a few people that were obsessed with beating people over the head with fear called Stark “feminine” because it wasn’t “hyper-aggressive.”
The thing is, the title has about 85% of Emperor’s status scripting, and the ONLY reason for this nonsense is because it was the first unisex title – and the label of “Any Gender” brought out the worst biases in people. There wasn’t even a report of Stark being “weaker” until this stuff occurred:
If you got on stage with Stark and froze, that’s your own issue – there’s more than enough resilience scripting from Emperor, balanced with social alpha scripting from Daredevil, True Social and other titles to handle dealing with fame.
Stark was literally the pinnacle of tech at the time, because we had applied everything we knew about taking scripting from other titles and adapting it to fit a new goal. For almost a year after release, there were no issues, people were enjoying the sub, most were shocked at how alpha it actually felt and how often they started getting laid.
Then someone started posting about “feminine energy” being brought out, which they defined as being more social. And you have to ask yourself where the notion of being social and popular became “feminine.” In what world is being personable and outwardly friendly, but rock solid on the inside and devoted to achieving your tech goals inherently “feminine”?
So, what – unless you’re running around acting like Wolverine, you’re not “masculine?” Are we really going to argue that Captain America’s MCU depiction isn’t masculine? But here’s the thing. We made “Wolverine” titles. It’s called Emperor, lol. Go run that if that’s what you want. If you want the best of both worlds, stack them like you do for every title. But no, you’re trying to apply some kind of odd social pressure to get us to change title (which, I assure you won’t work, I’m more liable to sunset the title in these situations).
But anyway – then another individual, who I’m most definitely going to call out, started talking about the “Any Gender” label.
But again, Stark has a ton of this scripting. The only thing that’s “missing” is the scripting from Emperor that’s responsible for the “anti-social” effect, where one retreats from the world and does their own thing. And the purpose of this scripting fits Emperor’s goals – you’re building something from sheer will, with no need for a team, or help. Just hard work.
Stark is a different animal. It is meant for collaboration, for popularity, and for innovation. This notion that it’s “weaker” is absolutely absurd and getting to the point of straight up ignorance. It’s like saying Emperor is “weaker” than Wanted Black, since WB will manifest romance situations faster.
Well, no shit. 90% of WB’s scripting is focused on this, while Emperor contains much more wealth and business scripting. Neither is “weaker” than the other – it is simply a different tool. People go on YouTube and watch videos on subliminals and energy and the occult, and then assume they know what we’re doing, and will argue with us on these topics.
And that’s exactly what happened – they saw the words “any gender” and lost their collective minds, assuming that we put “feminine” concepts into the script rather than the VERY OBVIOUS ANSWER that we simply avoided pronouns and the such.
We made it clear that the title was written from the standpoint of “traditional masculinity.” Now, we get three thousand questions in support from people asking “iS sTaRk fEmiNine,” when people can’t even define what they mean by that. Just some nonsense they saw here.
So what you have is a situation where a person is “afraid they will become feminine” and then start looking for any signs that Stark “feels feminine.” Let some recon hit and they shed a tear and OMG I AM BECOMING A WOMENZ ON STARK IT IS THE ANY GENDER."
Even if we filled Stark to the brim with Emperor’s scripting, unless we changed the label from “Any Gender,” you’re going to get people saying this same nonsense, because it has nothing to do with the script itself and everything to do with the attitude the individual has when using it. Remember, subliminal audio isn’t “mind control” like some people want to put out there.
Your mindset very much affects the performance. You go in with an open mind and you get high flow factor. You try to apply too much limited logic based upon your own experiences, you stunt the script. You literally create blockages and situations where recon will develop, because you’re too busy wondering if a result is too “feminine” rather than understanding where your own mind is trying to take you.
So – no, Stark will remain Stark. No other title has this “issue.” Stark only does because it was the first we labeled “any gender.”
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Instead of sunsetting it, relaunch it under a different name. I think that the issue (partly comes) from some people really thinking that the Stark sub is going to turn them into Tony Stark. You would have called it “The Innovator” or “The Trailblazer”, we would probably not see any of this nonsense. Have you ever wonder why people aren’t complaining that Renaissance Man lacks a masculine edge? The name is not triggering any “I need hyperdominance” feelings.
That much is clear to most of us. So you’re really going to sunset a program just because a few people aren’t willing free a spot in their stack and add GLM to Stark and get whatever “hard masculine edge” they’re looking for?
Here is my proposition: sunset the name, don’t sunset the sub, rewrite the copy.
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Definitely agree here. Not sure how I feel about the name.
Personally I don’t even see where Stark DOESN’T embody the archetype of Tony Stark, like really, where is it lacking in “Become Tony Stark?”
Tony gets angry sometimes, and yells and gets what he wants, because his character is in a freaking movie and has to experience a range of emotion, but that doesn’t mean that the sub should make you use anger to get what you want. It’s just a movie, lol. Tony gets what he wants through everything that is in the sub and that Saint is describing. People around Tony are literally flabbergasted and annoyed at how good he is at charming people on demand.
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Naw, we’re not going to sunset it. We’re also not changing the name either. That would create an absurd amount of confusion with customers and even so, I’d rather them see these debates than to hide the title away under a new name. Not our style.
Thing is, people are just projecting nonsense onto Tony Stark anyway. He wasn’t even the “beat over the head” type of masculinity. He just did his own thing, regardless of what anyone said and quipped about it. All of which, and more is included in Stark.
There is nothing weak about Stark. @Tomcat ran Stark, got immense fame to the point of being on television, choked and blamed the “feminine energy” rather than addressing the internal issue. We don’t rebrand and change entire subs because people have an issue with the words “Any Gender.”
If we made “Innovator ZP,” that shit would still say “Any Gender.” It’d be the same script, with the same stuff, still classified as an alpha title, but because it’s not associated with “Tony Stark” (which it technically isn’t, Marvel – Stark is just a word!) suddenly it’s okay?
tf?
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I don’t think some realize that the whole point of Stark in my opinion is to become a social charismatic leader similar to Tony Stark. A archetype like this doesn’t need some kind of hyper dominance or super alpha behaviour. I never understood people who complained about that not being in it. The whole GOAL of Stark as I seen it is to be someone who works with a team and is social and loves to network. I usually don’t get pissed off but like common man Stark is the most life changing sub I’ve ever used. The fact that people complain about it is absurd to me considering those same people don’t even take action on the sub goals. I went from a depressed loser with 0 friends and 0 income to someone who finally felt happy with a dream social circle that supports me and a high paying job that people dream to have. All from Stark. This took skills, charisma, hard work and intelligence which all came from Stark. I’m not even the only one I can name another 10 people who had amazing results with Stark too.
All in all, Stark is a life changing sub, people just need to stop complain and actually use it properly.
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@SaintSovereign : With HoM becoming more and more popular, get ready to have the same conversation about that sub. “I feel like HoM isn’t alpha enough”! 
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Tony Stark is legit not hyperdominant. There’s no reason why they should change the name of the title. Stark is the Tony Stark archetype if someone has a different definition of how they see Tony Stark that’s there problem. 99% of people here agree that Stark achieves the Tony Stark archetype pretty well. Do people really think Tony Stark is some kind of hyper masculine guy who does all by himself and is “hyper alpha”? If yes, you really need to rewatch the movie and read about who he actually is because it’s clear to me and others he’s not and that’s a good thing because to be a social charismatic leader hyper dominance is the polar opposite of what you need.
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Rewriting the copy or adding to the copy makes a lot of sense.
The first objective in Chosen From Within is a disclaimer that the objectives are very few, but each one hits very deep. It has 9 objectives. Stark has 8.
Mogul and Ascension have about 16-ish each.
GLM:CO has 13 but they’re much shorter sentences than Stark’s.
So the only thing that’s resonating here for me on this discussion about Stark’s “lack” is just the objectives and description. It doesn’t make sense that GLM:CO, Mogul, and Ascension have more objectives than Stark, considering Stark has all this stuff from emperor, plus true social, daredevil, PS, etc., it would make sense to have a very long objectives list.
It was SC directly that stated the more marketing materials are available on any given sub, the more effective the sub becomes. That’s why John Wingliss and The Revelator are characters. That’s why sales copy for RoS and the like get longer and longer and people love those subs more and more. That’s why HERO’s sales page is an epic work of art, visually and linguistically.
And that’s why people are head over heels for those subs right now… yes the new subs have innovations in tech… but they also have innovations in marketing, which is how people make their opinions about what results to expect and what things in life to take conscious action on.
I personally read the sales page and think it’s enough, but if you guys are getting all these support tickets about it being too feminine or whatever, if it’s a repeated task again and again that the support team has to address individually, why not address it once and for all on the sales page directly?
That’s iterative testing, right? If we run into an issue repeatedly, we try and stop it from becoming an issue permanently with a fix like that.
It’s like anything else in life and media, the people who are unhappy are usually the fewest and the loudest, whereas the people that are happiest are generally too busy being happy… that’s true in video game reviews, politics, subs, and beyond.
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People actually need to leave Stark alone and run LBFH instead and fix whatever self-esteem issue is making them feel like hyperdominant alphaness is the Holy Grail to success and social interactions. There, I said it!
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HoM has like 90% of Emperor’s script, and then a ton of original scripting. It’s just a big sub and requires more time for your to interpret and express the scripting. That one’s easy – I wouldn’t even go for it, everyone. Every title isn’t going to feel exactly the same.
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I think some people think angry means “alpha” in their brain and so since Stark doesn’t make them angry it’s not “alpha” which makes no sense and has no logic behind it.
The reason he gets what he wants is not because he “out-alphas people” it’s because he’s a genius charismatic playboy 
Thats what EXACTLY I meant!
Exactly - I’m saying that just because he gets angry in the movies doesn’t mean that in order to be stark you have to blow up at people in real life. His anger is an example of him NOT living up to his own ideals. It’s him in moments of weakness and frustration because he cares about the world but also has a prickly little ego that likes to be right.
That anger, funnily enough cuz @ksub has been harping LBFH this whole thread, that anger comes from Tony’s Ego, not his best self, so even HE needs to run LBFH!
Being smarter than people and more charismatic and being more right and having more friends and having more success as a result of that IS Alpha 
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I think the issue lies in them not actually even taking action on social interactions. @Jouissance and @Extraordinaire knows me better then anyone here and know for a fact I work my a** off to get the social results I get now. I used Stark and worked my social life like I never did before and got social results from it that even I’m shocked by to this day.
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And we will, when we upgrade the title. All of the rewritten titles and upgrades have been receiving brand new copy, (ex: SSX).
We have no problem with those types of suggestions. We didn’t even have a problem with people suggesting that they wanted more resilience in the face of fame. The issue came down to this nonsense about it being “weaker” or “feminine” because it didn’t feel like Emperor, and that only happened because it was the first title listed as “Any Gender.”
Which is rooted in sexism and prejudice, whether they want to realize it or not. “Oh no, how could the title be alpha and hard hitting if a WOMAN IS CAPABLE OF RUNNING IT?”
Us: We just said the language is conditional, allowing women to run it. The viewpoint is still the same – it’s very much a “traditional masculinity” sub. We didn’t cut anything to make it “easier” to run. We didn’t cut anything because we were worried what might happen if a woman ran it. When women have asked us about Stark, we made it clear – don’t be shocked if you feel more aggressive, because it’s very much written from the perspective of what one would call “traditional masculinity.”
Again, the issue stems from self-sabotage. People so damaged by “gender neutral” concepts blasted on the media that they literally hurt their own results, then use that as affirmation that it’s “feminine.”
It’s an absolute cluster.
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@SaintSovereign, calling somebody shit is rude. No problem, its your forum, but… you know, @ksub is right.
We saw Tony Stark in movies, read comics he can be very dominant.
And, btw, Stark being “feminine” is not MINE proposition. I think that Alphamale named it feminine, no?
I already explained what I wanted from Stark.
It was A FEEDBACK, not critique.
So, sunsetting of interesting sub that was, as I remember a “pinnacle of best parts of Emperor(!), Daredevil” and etc… its your choice, of course, you are a master but… is it a bit harsh?
Pretty sure “that shit” was reffering to the new sub name man.
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