Which sub(s) work directly on the "Nice Guy" syndrome?

Questions and Comments
#42

And I totally agree with you @James.

I wanted to include the word “unconsciously” in my statement above but decided to leave it out as it did not sound as good.

Khan ST1 removes everything that is holding you back to become the man you personally would love to be.

You don’t need to have a clear vision of your ideal self consciously for it to work (although this can certainly help). We all have a personal picture of our ideal self stored unconsciously, and Khan will dig it out and will make you take action until you become it.

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#43

@friday Exactly. Getting back to the " Nice Guy" aspect I feel a lot of what " Nice Guys " do and how they believe and act is because they think they have to be a certain way. That’s a big part of why I said what I did about trying to be something you’re not. Not anyone specifically but you get my point. I see it every day taking public transportation here of folks living up to a stereotype to be accepted which always has me curious as to how happy or miserable these people are. I have done a lot of things in my life including keeping my mouth shut, cutting my hair short , or wearing clothes I hated just to get a bit of acceptance or please someone else. Usually a girl. One of the most prominent things I have gained in the last two weeks of running Total Breakdown is that I’m done doing anything just to please someone else. On the flip side of that there are times I don’t really feel like doing certain things such as going grocery shopping or doing laundry but I still do them anyway just to get it down. I’ve said for a long time I have always wanted to be a guy who is able to just let go and do his do his own thing. Total Breakdown is helping make that a reality.

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#44

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In case anyone is curious this is me.

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#45

I’m in a reflective mood this evening. Another thing I have gained from running Regeneration for a period of time and now Total Breakdown is becoming increasingly aware of my past mistakes and behavior was very self defeating and how to avoid anything like that from happening in the future.
There is a quote from the movie Fight Club that feels incredibly apropos to what I’ve been through in the last few years as well as everything I am gaining from running Total Breakdown
" It’s only after we’ve lost everything that we’re free to do anything "

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#46

Diesel from WWE :beer:

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#47

If it were possible, I’d love to have SC create a sub tailored for the nice guy. I spent the last half hour reading into No More Mr. Nice Guy to pick up stuff I’ve been terrified of. I’ve owned this book for over a month, and this is the second time I opened it up. The first page I opened up to spoke right to that core fear of mine.

Because it stated the reason some guys trade everything they want in life for this: we don’t want to be abandoned. Up until 2 years ago, I would have skipped over that. Abandonment often refers to a physical break of a relationship, whether it’s a parent deserting his family, or a lover leaving a relationship.

What I discovered, and what I experienced a lot growing up, was how a child interprets it. I’m 3 or 4, talking to my mom, thinking she wants to hear what I have to say, so I let it out. Out of nowhere, she snaps loudly and harshly “GO PLAY WITH YOUR BROTHERS!!” It was often much worse, but all it takes is one time to learn I won’t be going back for more. I learned it is unsafe to be vulnerable to women. I shut down my desire to receive love from the only adult available for me. I also learned “it’s not safe being me. I’ll be BETTER next time.” I believed it was my fault, and it created a belief that the real me is bad. It created a toxic shame about who I am. And I’ve spent my life trying to hide this “badness” from myself and anyone I interact with. I can put on a good show, but it’s all aimed at you not seeing this badness.

From this pain, I learned to abandon myself, especially when strong emotions come up. This is why I “perform” a lot, secretly hoping no one knows I’m being dishonest with them or myself. Dr. Glover says that essentially all nice guys are dishonest. Guilty.

I’m going to share the benefits Glover states when one begins overcoming the nice guy lifestyle.

These men:

Accept themselves just as they are
Use their mistakes as valuable learning tools
Stop seeking the approval of others
Experience loving and intimate relationships
Make their needs a priority
Find people who are able and willing to help them meet their needs
Learn to give judiciously and with no strings attached
Face their fears
Develop honesty and integrity

@SaintSovereign and @Fire, with Q coming out, is it possible to create a sub addressing these needs?

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#48

My opinion:

The subliminal solution to the ‘Nice Guy’ syndrome is already here, and with the individually configurable modules of the Quintessence option it’ll be even more accessible.

‘Nice Guy’ syndrome is essentially a boundaries issue.

The person 1) gives others around him excessive influence over his own frames and context, and 2) numbs out and disconnects from his own values, priorities, organismic feedback processes. It’s basically an understandable response to power-related trauma (low-grade or intense) during one’s formative years.

In my opinion, a worthy subliminal ‘treatment regimen’ would include 4 main elements:

  1. Regeneration to process and release the power-related and attachment-related traumas that led to this interpersonal orientation in the first place

  2. Godlike Masculinity - to establish and strengthen firm boundaries and greater comfort with enforcing those boundaries

  3. Either the Emperor or the Khan progression (in other words, Ascension leading up to Emperor, or Ascension leading up to Khan or Ascension leading to Emperor and then later to Khan)

And finally the MOST important element

  1. setting up personally-meaningful GOALS related to one’s dreams, valued lifestyle, and personal pleasure.

The process of working towards those goals is what will allow the subliminals to achieve their effects.

I think that Spartan and/or Emperor Fitness wouldn’t hurt somewhere in that process either. Earlier if one’s valued goals are fitness-related, later if they’re not. Power Can Corrupt has been helpful to other nice guys as well. It seems to make it much more difficult to use the usual denial-based strategies to procrastinate facing up to the dynamics that one is creating.

That could be done now. And it would work.

With Q? I imagine other even more pinpointed configurations could be created. That’s up to the insight and creativity of the individual.

But the element of using goals and real-world action to give the subconscious mind something to work with seems to be key, no matter what program is being used.

To me, it’s not that you’re ‘making the subliminals work’ by setting goals and taking action. It’s more like this: if you’re asking Da Vinci to draw you a masterpiece, the least you can do is provide him with some decent art materials.

The subconscious requires a medium through which to work. It will ultimately find one either way, but we can also choose to help it out with that part.

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#49

Wow, that is a very deep realization. Are you still listening to Khan St1?

I don’t see the need for a nice guy subliminal. Whatever subliminal you are running right now already seems to strongly deal with that fear and past traumatic events which prohibited you to express the real you. Stay strong @subliminalguy! If you already have such consciousness, you are almost there.

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#50

The vulnerability of childhood is crazy. So intense, particularly for some of us.

On the one hand, children are basically geniuses; powerfully taking in and imprinting so much of what’s going on. On the other hand, being so new to the earth, they have such limited cognitive capacity available for things like critical thinking, reframing, or even identifying and setting barriers against noxious or dysfunctional influences.

Somehow most of us seem to survive the process because we’re endowed with such vast stores of resilience. But the journey is fraught with peril.

It’s normal to emerge with blockages, fixations, and stuck places. Places where we’re avoiding processing pain.

Of course, avoiding processing your pain leads to emotional stiffness, loss of psychological responsiveness/flexibility, and significant perceptual blind spots as we move around and interact with others. And as a result of those blind spots we tend to be unaware of the pain of others around us and how we may or may not be feeding into it.

And so the cycle continues.

Probably without exception, any parent who took part in traumatic moments for their child was blinded by their own defenses against their own internalized traumas. That’s not an excuse, it is a cautionary tale.

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#51

@Malkuth, you’re closer to seeing the problem better in this last post. The first one I’ll reply to by analogy.

A wealthy couple living next to a lake returned from vacation, and they couldn’t see their sports car which had been parked in front of the lake. They panicked and reported it to the police as being stolen. A week went by, and a groundsman spotted it. It had rolled into the lake. A tow truck was called, they pulled it to shore, and chose to leave it there since they’d have their many workers clean it up nicely. It took 3 months, but they went so far as to even give it a new paint job. It was beautiful and ready to go.

A month later, they took another trip. They returned to find their car missing again. This time, the husband walked around the lake. He spotted it. It had rolled back into the water. They’d done a great job the first time…but did they ever check the parking brake? It had failed again.

Calling boundaries the main issue in the nice guy syndrome is like cleaning up the car, yet ignoring why it rolled in the water. Having poor boundaries is just a symptom of the root problems. The problems are the negative internal self-beliefs, the shame which is felt in every part of life, and the never-ending fear of being abandoned. Those issues are why I’m here.

I want a brake job, not a paint job. Adding New Beginnings to Emp4 was a lifesaver since it was powerfully working on true insecurities and blocks. I overdid my loops with it, and subsequently became angrier, a nice guy no-no. And I realized this weeks after I’d stopped it and had already begun EOG. The reason I asked Saint and Fire about it is no one here knows what New Beginnings focuses on yet, though it’s pointed toward the Imposter Syndrome in Emp4.

I ask since I’ve been focusing on being “shiny” when the real problems sit and fester. ST1 is picking at it, but I believe ST1 works where you sit in it until you decide SOMETHING’S GOT TO CHANGE. It’s time.

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#52

I’m noticing that I’m in a kind of a Dry, Airy kind of mental space today. It’s part of my own internal process; part of reconciliation/integration actually. You, on the other hand, are actively working and swimming in the Water of your emotional healing and emotional process. My first post did not really meet your energy halfway. It was not a very Feeling post. It’s not surprising that it, or at least that one line describing ‘nice guy’ syndrome as a boundaries issue, struck you as sort of superficial and misguided (i.e., like recommending a paint job for a car with worn-out brakes). A bit like a marketing agent talking to an artist about how to describe his work.

Nonetheless, I do think that those 4 elements would deal well with the generic Nice Guy syndrome (as it is experienced by many, many people). It will take time and painful growth, but the tools are there. As to the exact road that you should take for your own personal variant? There I will not presume. Nor does it seem necessary to do so. You’re working on it.

This point of view can sometimes seem brusque or facile, but: it’s not always necessary to analyze every aspect of an issue in order to be free of it. If I’m walking down the street and step in dog poop, I do not need a chemical assay of the fecal matter. A water hose will do just fine. (There’s my own scatological analogy. A scatalogy?)

Sometimes, it doesn’t come off, though. The water hose doesn’t work. And you do need some (or a lot of) analysis and painful work to figure out why it’s not budging. So, that’s that.

I hear you. That’s real. I honor you and I honor your journey.

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#53

Thank you @Malkuth

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#54

I’ve been using EOG ST1 for almost 2 months now. When reconciliation hit me early on, I was surprized since Kahn ST1 didn’t have those effects on me. EOG has definitely been a ride.

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#55

Not sure whether this has already been mentioned. Women are not attracted to arse holes and jerks. They are attracted to certain qualities that arse holes and jerks project.

I believe you can be a nice guy but have strong boundaries in place. Basically when to say yes and when to say no.

Alongside running a product like Emperor I would suggest googling images for the "hottest women"on the planet. Look at them then check there images without their makeup and hair done. Notice that they are human beings like you and me. Who fart, smell and can look rough at times.

Simply going to evenings classes like knitting, hat making, language course are great place to practice socializing with women. I use to do a lot of cold approaching but this is not necessary its just about getting out there and talking, interacting. Have a conversation with a woman without having to have an agenda.

If guys still have issues then the problem might be deeper. Something that needs to be resolved some past issue. Bullying, brought up by parents who set high expectations and you didn fulfill them leading to disappointment all round. These experiences can lead us to not wanting to disappoint others which including friends, colleagues and women.

I know this because I have been there being the ÿes"man because that’s what I was brought up to believe. Most of my issues I have managed to overcome but there are still some issues I struggle with even these days. Still things take time to heal.

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#56

Boundaries. That is all.

Narcissistic mothers violate children’s boundaries - physical, emotional and sexual - so much so that the idea of practising boundaries even with self evokes such survival terror.

The first relationship with women a boy has is with mother. Once that’s resolved, relations with other women can prosper. Helicopter parents also needs dealing with in the same way.

Individuation and developing masculinity are the keys to curing Nice Guy Syndrome. Being an aggressive manchild dickhead isn’t.

Fortunately SubClub have several solutions (EmperorQ, AscensionQ, KhanQ)

Nice use of the British word arsehole, @TheBoxingScientist…

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#57

Hey what’s PCC again? New to subclub. Thanks

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#58

Coz I am british mate :rofl:

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#59

Every time I hear the word mate I think about the video :joy: Gordan Ramsay definitely cured the Nice Guy syndrome… He actually has a big heart though

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#60

@Sigma11

PCC = Power Can Corrupt

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#61

@TheBoxingScientist:

cc @friday

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