@Wonders do you have any knowledge on how dreams relate to reality or one’s reflection in general? It doesn’t even need to relate to those, I’m just trying to figure out the relationship between my dreams and how my life has unfolded in the past twoish years.
Right now I only really utilize them as a form of communication between my conscious and subconscious, and a way to identify what to work on to help with any processing or recon I’m going through. I would love another perspective!
I think I know that learning to control dreams will inherently have a widespread effect on the rest of my life, and that’s why I’m scared of it. The act of reality creation in general. I’m stuck in the comfort of having everything made for me, both in terms of my real life circumstances and in the dreams I live through.
I guess I had my strongest lucid experience during a nap today, when I went to sleep going back to a dream I had a while back. The first dream was more related to processing, yet once it was done, transitioned into almost a continuation of the previous one. Not really a “continuation”, but more just the version of me now going through a scenario similar to then, that’d probably have days to weeks or months of space between them. In the dream, when I thought I wanted to do something, I did it. When I wanted something or some reaction, I immediately got it in a way that felt scarily real. The timeloop thing that happens during dreams just turned into me directly modifying it for my own pleasure/benefit, not to optimize an outcome anymore. I knew I was coming up on some identity level change soon, but I didn’t think it’d have to do with this. I think I’m a little scared to have control over my destiny, if that makes sense. It isn’t about the cards I’ve been dealt anymore, since I have the power to push past and adapt to any obstacle that comes up.
Edit: I also say I think this is my strongest/first lucid experience due to the fact that in normal cases, the dream would have qualified as a vivid one that’d lead to an identity shift in me. But I didn’t feel that from this, if anything it’s more like prompting to explore the feeling of reality creation more. Don’t know what’s coming, but I know my perspective’s gonna be completely blown out of the water soon
I may have some clues that I gathered from experimenting on myself through lucid dreams when I was younger, and insights gotten meditating on ancient texts,
though this is better taken as a belief and view from my limited perspective.
You will have to experiment yourself to check if that resonate and if these beliefs/insights/understandings are useful to you or not.
From my lucid dreams experimentation, we can arrive inside our inner world by teleporting outside dream-space.
What’s useful about this inner world, is that it stays the same until modified.
When we create something through conscious imagination, it may appear in that inner world.
Inside the inner world we can create whatever we want through will and imagination, including “simili-conscious” task-entities like parogen/tulpas.
Though, we can also create rules that this inner world(s)(there can be multiple planes) respects, such as gravity, day night cycles, meteo.
I call the dream us, the unconscious-conscious “spirit” (the place where dreams and thoughts take place)
Much like how I call the body-mind “soul”. (the place in our body where the inner worlds, containing memories and experiences are)
From my experience, we can also split our spirit creating headmates, or fuse them together if they agree, or dissolve them, but I digress.
When there are multiple spirits in a soul, many alters/headmate in a body, in a system, you can see that there are memories that aren’t yours that are locked, that you may not see, and other that are open.
There can be places locked off or places with different rules, and when an alter/headmate put a rule into place, it is extremely difficult if not impossible to dissolve it, it require agreement amongst the majority of alters in the system.
Personally, I see the collective unconscious as the domain in which the divine resides as diverse archetypes and collective egregores.
Where there are both gods/devas, angels/demons, dragons, and such residing in it. Created from the collective imaginative power.
Both the Christian gnostics and taoist explain the world as a dream, God/Brahma’s dream.
And so, I see us as being kind of like dream characters?
Dream characters are both a projection of the unconscious and their own person. They may possibly access the entire subconscious but often only reflect a very limited part of the whole.
And similarly do I see us, humans, animals, other, as projection from the collective unconscious, acting in God’s dream world, with the in-between and astral and “higher” being kind of like God’s inner world? And so, the akashic archives would be the archives of God’s inner world, similar to my own memory archives in my inner world? With some memories across the ensemble of possibilities across time space open, and other locked off.
Hence, we can create an universe inside us, and similarly live in an universe, but as we can put on rules in our inner world(s) that may only be dissolved if all participating parties decide so, similarly do we have rules in the external world that may only be changed if all participating parties decide so or at least agree.
I see all experiences, good or bad, as something that we may have agreed to either before we incarnated or even now being incarnate, as things we would like to experience for mutual benefit or for growth.
And in my experience, experiences won’t be denied and all simili-conscious tasks (such as angels, demons, other forces of nature and chance, etc.) Will work from the collective subconscious “divine” to coordinate personal subconscious together in crafting a given commonly agreed/desired experience.
So like, if you wish to have a good job that earn a bunch of money, you will eventually find it as your unconscious will guide you toward corresponding businesses and enterprises , and your unconscious will know it both through what you see and through the influence/instinct of the collective subconscious
And if it’s something that seem plausible in the collective subconscious, then it’ll have a higher likelihood of being tacitly accepted/occuring
Though, collective growth (and so, in my view, the growth of God’s subconscious) should be the goal, as a harmonious world in which all of us, of the same nature, work toward doing good (without being to our detriment) would benefit everyone on Earth and beyond.
This is a bit long, whenever I have some time I’ll see to drawing a quick diagram explanation and edit it to this message if you want.
So, we got our subconscious, with the dream world(s):
inside our mind-body “soul”, our inner world(s):
within the universe dream world(s):
I also found the following message from SoulFire that’s a great explanation Main Disc. Thread - The Revelation of Dreams ZP - #201 by SoulFire
We always have influence on what surrounds us. Though these diagrams/view are the egotistical separatist one, the ones that’s more visible.
(To be clear, both the one above and below represent the same reality, only seen from different lenses.)
Another would be the one in which the illusion of separation doesn’t exist:
We as a bunch of particules that interact with one another
The interactions between particles inside our aggregate “me” mind-body are things like “sensations”, “thoughts”, “emotions”, the conscious, outer it’s more like, where I walk (touch something), when I talk (make particule vibrate in the air), when I move, when I touch, etc…
The pattern etched through particles become the subconscious.
If we have an habit of positive thought, it might become a subconscious personality trait through emotion and repetition (more emotion = more energy spent and greater engraving of the pattern onto the subconscious, hence trauma)
And when we touch or hold something or keep it close, it become part if our field and our energy run through them and their patterns and their energy run through us and our patterns, like this right person holding a mug.
The closer they are, and the more emotion/energy, (so, either physically or emotionally closer) the deeper the patterns are influenced by the other’s pattern.
and the more we do it, the longer we spend influencing “the other”, and being influenced by “the other”.
we are on Earth, another dense aggregate of particles with energy running through it
Earth energy also run through us through the magnetosphere, influencing our patterns, our subconscious, with their patterns of Nature.
And we also influence Earth through our biofield with our own patterns / subconscious.
And our pattern are affected by our conscious thoughts, as they are patterns.
When we die, our energy leave our body and dissipate around.
Only what energy other aggregates brings, such as maggots, bioorganisms, the Earth, passes through the particules that made our body and take what nutrients they need from it.
Hence, all of us participate in building the mutual experience of reality by influencing the surrounding energetic pathways, other people as well as the greater metapattern, with our own energetic patterns/pathways and the emotional impact we cause in others.
The meta-pattern is the pattern of energetic exchange amongst the aggregates of particles “humans” “animals” “plants” “earth” within the aggregate of aggregates “all there is” “the universe”.
So, the “subconscious” of “the universe” is made of all the “subconscious” of its parts influencing each other through the “conscious thoughts”(inner) and “actions”(outer) the energetic exchanges.
And we always influence the world around us with our subconscious through the energetic emotional impact we have. And all there is always influence us in the same way, through the emotional impact it has on us and energy exchange.
And though the universe and ourselves are ever changing, all impacts resonate, the impact that we have on the world has an effect that is felt by all the beings within.
and the greater the impact, the more the pattern that made us ourself, our subconscious, is engrammed onto the world, the collective of all aggregates.
Both the particles and the energy that makes “us”, our thoughts, actions, feelings, etc. remains and are reused within the universe.
when we die, our body heat/energy gets diffused and dissolve in the great all there is
much like our body then become feed and nutrients for both the ground and animals.
both the energy that made our conscious and the particles that made our body are thus cycled and reused.
If you have the time that’d be great!
Thank you for giving me your perspective! I’m gonna spend some time digesting and see what parallels there are and what applies to my current situation.
Alright, took the time to draw what needed drawing and add the explanations for the drawings, hopefully that’ll resonate with you and be helpful on your quest ^^
Thank you so much for giving such a detailed reply I’m able to apply! A lot to dig into for different points in my life.
I think this is what I’m trying to get used to. I’ve very much been able to get away with not perceiving the impact I have on the world. As in, I think, because of how focused and “in my own bubble” school requires me to be, I end up interacting and immediately retreating back to a mental place where it’s just me, allowing me to not see what kind of influence I’m having outside of the obvious short-term. That bubble is comfortable, but I feel it’s slowly breaking. I can’t NOT have an influence on the world around me when I’m listening to these subs, especially Stark Black. I’m not the type to handwave results, but I’m also not the type to give myself the benefit of the doubt. I always try to assume the worst and give myself little wiggle room so that it’s difficult for me to not be able to deal with something. If I assume this person is neutral or doesn’t like me, and don’t carry the assumption strongly enough to create a feedback loop, then it’s just keeping me prepared for the worst possible situation. It leads to more pleasant surprises, but I’m able to deal with those much easier than unpleasant ones. I even downplay the elements of the subs that I do get here. I’ve had almost every feature of Stark Black manifest at least once, and if someone close to me were to look at the copy, they’d see a ton of parallels. It’s weird to think of, but it’s like my presence is starting to be accepted like that by the collective unconscious. I think it’s the fact that it’s almost all been foundational that keeps me still able to get away with this. But the fact that things are starting to progress to the point past foundations means that my time ignoring my own impact will end soon. There was some post (a couple I believe) of Saint saying how we’re typically blind to a lot of the changes we get, and it’s more after looking back or seeing that change reflected back at us that we’ll see it. It’s part of the reality bending nature of ZP.
I think this is what my subconscious wants me to become aware of next. The act of creation itself becomes second nature both while asleep and awake, and I’m needing to be eased into that fact. It feels as if both of these skills are coming at once, as despite me not trying to use dreams to manifest, whenever RoD is in my stack, manifestations increase in frequency an insane amount. Could the amount of control I have over my own dream world translate to the control I have over my waking one? It honestly feels a little unprecedented to think that this power could increase, considering how when using these subs, one’s power to manifest already skyrockets.
From your view on consciousness, it’s almost as if the barriers on every level are becoming more permeable. My thoughts and memories bleed into every dream, along with the separation between me and other people. One dream I haven’t talked about was one where I dreamt of the contents of an email I got, from the perspective of my coworker profusely apologizing for a paperwork issue we had. Thinking back even to almost two years ago, before I ever even knew where I’d be working, I met her indiscriminately. There was synchronicity I can identify now, since I met her twice within the span of a week. After that second time, I had a dream about her that I couldn’t understand, only for six months later, her to be the reason I was hired and the one I’ve been working closely with to this day. It feels as if the lines are, and have been bleeding on every level.
I’m curious of your perspective of people that frequently appear in dreams. Obviously on some level they represent a part of ourselves, but on some level, do you believe we’re really interacting with that other person? And then what of famous people? Surely they’re dealing with people either dreaming of or projecting their desires onto them. What kind of impact is that having on them? If I’m the subject of someone’s dream, obviously I’m influencing them, but in what way are they influencing me?
The last time I was being led to some big revelation, I was in mild recon for an entire day. It felt almost full body, yet not strong enough to impact that day’s interactions. And then, all of a sudden, I woke up in the middle of the night and couldn’t fall back asleep. Then it just felt like reality itself shifted and I was a little freer. Nothing else different that I could recognize at the time, but I knew that something had changed. I theorized back then I could feel something related to invisible currents that were flowing. I later noticed that my freedom and ability to adapt to dreams had skyrocketed, on top of my results too. I believe now that it was me learning to adapt to dream’s logic, translating into me just being able to adapt to most “logic” in general. I have to take action in dreams, I don’t have time to ponder or think it over, and that started to bleed into real life. Slowly, but it’s gotten to the point where I trust myself so much more going into situations blind or without a plan, since I know I can adapt and improvise my way through them.
My way of coping or deflecting is also a form of giving up power. “I have no control over this,” “Life just happens, there’s nothing I can do.” While I don’t know what the correct attitude I should have is, I have a feeling I’m still gonna feel a shift similar to last time where I won’t understand it in the moment, and it’ll slowly unfold. I’m just wondering what the next attitude will be, because what should I be saying to these things? We don’t always have the power to control everything, how should I feel about that? I can exert strong influence over my own personal reality, but what do I do once it leaves my bubble of strong influence?
I’m glad that helped !
Absolutely, recognizing an issue is the first and most essential step in getting through it, so since you can name it we can be sure you’ll get through it soon, come back on the other side more assertive and more powerful than ever before, having destroyed that limit 
!
I’ll share with you a piece of wisdom I read somewhere, if you’re ok with it,
When you assume the worst, you suffer in all cases, either once from the assumption, or twice when things do go bad.
When you assume that things will go well, well you only suffer if they do go bad!
In buddhism, we talk about Gautama’s two arrow analogy
The Buddha once asked his student, “If a person is struck by an arrow, is it painful?”
The student nodded, yes.
The Buddha then asked, “If a person is struck by a second arrow, is that even more painful?”
The student again nodded, yes.
The Buddha then explained, “In life, we cannot always control the first arrow. However, the second arrow is our reaction to the first. The second arrow is optional.”
Pain is inevitable, but the suffering bought upon from our reaction to that pain, from us dwelling on it, is optional
A good thing, is that you did already realize yourself that this method is limiting ^^
Even though you get awesome results, an make a ton of progress at lighting speed ^^
You are very very right in that!!
And I’m very happy to hear of all the results you got, all that you’re able to see and understand through dreams, and all that you realize through Stark too ^^ This is great
From my perspective on famous people, having been close with multiple artists, DJs, musicians, singers, and even a scenarist, often they use an alter ego to alleviate some of the pressure.
Though, there’s an intense amount of pressure on them. To the point where they can physically feel the waves of energy from the public when they perform. Pressure even away from the scene sometimes, from the expectations projected onto them. I have yet to know a famous person that don’t take drugs, even those you wouldn’t expect like a pianist-singer. So I guess that’s how they deal with it.
For the last question, I have absolutely no idea lol, but my instinct tell me that you may be able to find out yourself?
Just a quick response while I’m out but it’s something I don’t want to ignore. I feel like I’m being given a path, literally being offered to me. It’s one that’s full of confronting my fears and one that my body feels scared of. But it’s one that can give me everything I’ve ever wanted and more. I think it’s full of things that I’m averse to, at least unconsciously, but it holds a ton of things that feel precious to both my inner child and me now. The spotlight is one thing, and what I feel might be the biggest right now. Like everything I want is locked behind the door of me meeting myself, and truly being able to accept the future identity I’ve always wanted.
I don’t intend on using drugs to get through things, so I really do wonder what I’ll be using as my own protection. But to me right now, it just feels like my body is coming up with any excuse it can to execute the script without being fully seen. Being known is fine, talked about is fine, but for some reason just the thought of being “seen” itself is scary.
I also feel as if because I keep myself in that bubble, I’m not sure if I can truly feel the emotions of people I haven’t opened myself up to at some point. Maybe that’s something I’ll discover as I begin to accept my life outside that bubble
Still contemplating where RoD and ASBR are leading me, but wanted to note something. In my listening to ASBR, a few weeks ago it felt as if things just started to click more. It had been about three months since I increased the build strength. When I first started, it felt like every loop was a riddle that would take days to unfold, understand, and make an attempt to solve. Now, it feels as if each loop is contributing to something greater, something tangible that I can somewhat understand. I wrote to support about being able to feel when the sub was processing pretty accurately and consistently. One loop would last for days, influencing a ton of my actions.
After I learned about the passing of someone I looked up to, I had played my second loop of the day in an “I don’t care what happens to me right now” kind of way. Other times when I did that, my dreams would immediately include riddles or sports I was outclassed in solving, leaving me waking up confused or exhausted. This time though, it felt as if something had clicked. The only reason (at least I believe) I got to meet this person was because of me listening to ASBR at release. The way it manifests meeting mentors and people in high places feels unmatched by even the updated Inner Circle. But coming to that realization, it’s almost like I felt an alignment to the script and who I was back then, and how I’ve evolved to now. I went to sleep that night, and instead of having another kind of overexposure dream, I fully processed one of the loops from the day, and got about halfway through the other. It’s another instance of me not knowing exactly what happened and me piecing together the clues after the fact, but I think that started some kind of subconscious opening up on a deep level. I’m more aligned with the archetype than I think I am, and I’m more open to change in that direction than I used to be.
I’ve been measuring both in dreams and in recon awareness since, and it genuinely does feel like each loop is processing in that ~24 hour period after, give or take depending on my quality of sleep. I just think this is interesting considering I don’t recall seeing the processing of a title getting faster being reported. The moment a loop plays now, it’s like there are multiple “dreams” ongoing in the back of my mind about its application. It’s really weird feeling how this sub originally went from one to only run with one other, to eventually feel like one that can be part of a normal stack. I also stacked it with Regeneration for about a month and a half (with Regen either immediately before or after so that they’d be processed/integrated together), which I believe helped with easing my mind into the deeper nature of it. I’m still trying to process that “click,” and I know my processing limit could’ve been considered abnormal even from the start, but I feel like there’s so much depth to that day I’m still trying to discover.
I fell asleep while meditating on this, and somehow RoD’s processing started getting resolved. I don’t know exactly what it’s doing right now, but I think me getting distracted from something else gave it the chance it needed. The answer I came to now, regarding the spotlight, is just that it’s a tool that needs to be used or managed. It’s not the end goal, and it shouldn’t be. It is, however, super valuable and can lead to things I might not even be able to see right now. Overall, I feel more comfortable with it now.
I’ve also stuck with the same sub for almost two years at this point. Results come and go, even though I’ve always consistently seen really good ones, it’s this deep work that I think is resonating the most with me. Hopefully in the next few months I’m able to detail more of what’s happened, since I saw insane manifestations within days of when I started listening.
In general, I feel like the best point of action would be to just carry no assumptions, no? I feel like when I assume things will go well, I’m opening up a weakness for being unprepared if they don’t, and if I assume they don’t, then I could be projecting onto the situation. If I carry a neutral perspective onto these situations, but rather keep my inner world in alignment with what I want to happen, do you think that might work as well? Like instead of hoping that a specific opportunity works out, I completely remove myself from even being dependent or thinking about it more than necessary. Instead, it’s almost like a quote I saved from Malkuth before, about holding one part of a phrase, and letting reality fill in the rest. Not falling into toxic positivity is also something I’m trying to avoid, since I got burned bad by doing that a few times.
Plus, I think not holding particular expectations for something specific in reality also makes adapting to pain, or any circumstances, much more effortless.
I’m always fine with these. I feel like interacting and answering questions in journals is really beneficial, it gives you the chance to to communicate and voice things you originally wouldn’t have if it were just one person talking into the void.
To bring up one more cool idea a little more related to the beginning of this, another thing in support I talked about was my idea of parallel processing. Back when I first ran everything in the same build and was still getting used to ZP in general, it felt like things meshed and integrated together and there wasn’t as much of a distinction between the processing of each script as I thought people made it out to be. Now, it feels like things just integrate on different levels at the same time, and they intermingle and go their own ways as they please. Both RoD and ASBR were processing, but both on different levels. It took me contemplating and bringing my awareness away from one for it to settle, and then once that settled, the other naturally fell into place. I don’t know what really I can comment on right now, other than that this experience isn’t really rare and feels super common. Things don’t happen in isolation from each other. I’m just hoping by the time they make more experimental builds available, I’ll be at a high enough rank to be able to play around with them and see how they differ from the ones now.
Found it. Hopefully that got formatted correctly.
Well, since expectations lead to suffering when they fail us, this would be the best way.
I still have trouble having no expectations at all, hence why I default to expectations that things will go well
And yeah absolutely!
Also, thank you for this discussion, it also helps me to have another perspective on these viewpoints, and being given an opportunity to reflect on all of this, the workings of the mind, and how it applies within the world.
I’m glad it’s helpful for both of us!
I think I know what my next big action is. Everything is already picking up for next month but I think if I can get this last bit done, it should just enhance literally everything and even improve my quality of life. Other than that, it’s still just resting and letting the subs do inner work for these next two weeks. That’s honestly my favorite part about not immediately jumping to do things, I can let myself rest and grow as the things I prepared finally start to come to fruition. And once they’re finally out, I’m already months ahead in planning. This year is definitely gonna be something.
Started Ascension Chamber again for the first time in over a year. I had a bad dream about something I wanted not working out, and the rest of my body was almost yelling at me about it. Then, it felt like I was drowning and I woke up shivering with my ears feeling unclogged as if I’d just come to the surface of water after being submerged. Kind of freaky and scary, but I know I’ll be fine even if I don’t necessarily know the meaning of it in the short term.
My two other dreams centered on me playing two different “games”, where I didn’t know how they worked or was missing a crucial rule from the start. Despite that, I was still playing decently well, enough for the other players to be wary of me and watching what I do so that I don’t suddenly surprise or upend them. The first dream ended with me finally getting told how the game mechanic worked, and I immediately improved to become one of the top players. The second one had my team at a pretty huge disadvantage, with less than half the time left. I finally had the rule explained to me, and I realized just how wrongly I was playing, but despite that still being decently targeted by other players. It very much ended in a “to be continued” manner even with a narrator summarizing all the events that happened. With that cliffhanger, I also was right about to fight one of the strongest opponents who had a genius plan from the start and lowkey cheats. I originally was going to try to run away without them noticing, but someone resembling Zelda was in their line of fire, and I essentially recreated one of the scenes from Breath of the Wild protecting her.
The interpretation of these feels a little obvious, but I guess I’m trying to identify what exactly this “game” could be and what the “rule” is that I’m missing in the waking world.
Edit: something making the interpretation even more obvious is that both of these dreams were part of the same “continuity.” It was the same me, and in the second one I even remember thinking how insane it was that the same kind of thing happened twice, and that I should be more mindful when learning “games.”
Took direct action to prevent this event from happening. Not on my damn watch. I’m also learning how important selective information revealing (or with the right timing) is, it’s a WDB result despite it being with ASBR situations/goals. I really do think that the intermingling of a “stack” is so underutilized/not fully understood here. If I stack ASBR and WDB, WDB will help with ASBR’s goals, and ASBR will help with WDB’s goals, each giving their own flavor and helping the other to grow in its own unique way that it wouldn’t have on its own previously (or at least taken a LONG time).
I also figured out an interpretation of the first game dream, still trying to work out the second.
Got a peek at the unexecuted ASBR scripting that’s being saved for when I’m back to my normal daily life, will probably take a pause on most listening for now. The my mind is already holding onto what it wants to work on, just waiting to fully execute it, so unless there’s something new or urgent I want to add I can just leave it as is. With the month I have lined up it’s definitely gonna start hitting hard. Probably gonna focus a bit more on WDB or go back to Regen for the next while, I want to feel good once I go back to everything.
The unexecuted stuff feels a lot like a kind of blueprint or plan in how they’ll be brought into my life. Like taking inventory and already knowing where all the items will go. There isn’t a lot of other stuff there, so I’m pretty sure it has to do with one of my theories before about how ZPQ “delays” execution and/or processing until there’s a suitable situation for it, vs everything else that processes and executes almost immediately for me.
What if the same kind of rules applied to real life, and we were able to analyze our waking world in the same way we do our dream symbolism?
