Main Idea Thread: Heartsong

successful heartsong run: I run it and I either meet and start dating a partner that I wish I could date “ideal dream partner” / “your soulmate” / “your romatic interest archetype that wants you” in both looks and archetype

or - the existing relationship shifts over time more into the kind of relationship we wish we could experience.

I bet there are girls all around youtube making all these “your crush wants you” and “manifest your ideal perfect partner” amateur subs. Its a huge demand and the wish is simple… they all want to date the guys they dream of. Someone to “rock their world” and someone to live life with like we only get to do it once. Desires are met, new passionate / fun experiences are unfolding all the time with them in the style and feel that the person has a taste in for themselves. I wish heartsong would be like that. Open for diverse desires to be fulfilled.

heartsong should teach and direct both people to find enjoyment in interacting and finding creative ways to make life fun between them two - heavily romantically - whatever shape that takes on depending on the person.

and please make it so we dont manifest avoidant attachment people cuz my lawd it takes two to tango and you cant do that when the other person tries to find reasons to break up. We want partners that want us and want to be with us… every day. and maybe a final script in the end that makes sure they align with us in what we want in the future so we can plan together easily whatever the adventure we choose together.

edit: okay lastly… a script that will allow us to still pursue our own identity alongside our love interest. And it working really well between us and them. A dynamic duo instead of us sacrificing our dreams of who we wish we could be to become smaller / fit around someone else as some side character in their story.


so - we are free and able to express ourselves the way we want while also having that “ideal partner we dream of” that want us and we both want a future the fits well together. plus its really fun for the two of us to interact together in ways we want depending on what were “into”.

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I don’t want this sub to get lost in the sauce/overcomplicated. I think much of the original Heartsong goals are good and should stay, like healing of past romantic traumas, manifesting partners who you’d deeply connect with, becoming more discerning about what you really want in a partner(s), etc. just all updated to the ZPU format.

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This feels like a critical component to consider including in the Heartsong ZPU upgrade.

Especially since the user will be listening to these profoundly transformative ZPU subliminals, it seems imperative that their partner be willing and able to grow alongside them, if the relationship is to ultimately be successful in the long term.

I’ve personally seen many relationships that started off strong eventually fall apart because one person kept growing while the other stayed stagnant. Over time, the gap between them became impossible to ignore.

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Basically what @Jouissance said: meeting you feels like a synchronicity for the girl

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Even though there are some good suggestions on this thread (like @cryo424 reminding us of what’s already in the copy about growing with your partner), I think it’s clear this is a sub that people are having a lot of recon about.

This one that a lot of people talked about, and the slightly reworded “meeting you feels like a synchronicity for the girl”… it brings up so many red flags.

First of all, to “make other people” do something or have an experience, breaks free will scripting. There is a big difference between, say, generating an aura of someone who is ready for a relationship and knows what they want, or whatever, which someone else can pick up on and react to on the one hand; on the other hand, “make them have this experience”, hell naw.

Secondly, let me give a real example from my own life. I know a person who met someone who has caused them a lot of positive growth, albeit not without a lot of drama and angst, and this person likes to keep telling me how much their connection feels like destiny, how important she is to him, and so on. Yet often she won’t show him the time of day, going off to do her own stuff a lot.

Well, I finally did her natal chart recently, and then synastry with the friend. Uranus-Saturn opposition, the man holds Uranus and the woman holds Saturn. This creates a kind of electric pursuit where to the man it feels karmic (Saturn), and the relationship feels like it challenges the woman’s sense of comfort or need to feel in control (Uranus). Is this a good dynamic for a relationship? Hell no! Although other aspects in the chart do soften that.

The point of that is: people’s natal charts and their connections can make people feel like they were “fated to meet” all the time, even as they work on mastering their own nature. I have my Saturn conjunct her Node as well, and this creates a similar “fated” dynamic, but it doesn’t make me her soulmate. What someone makes you feel stems from their core nature, their zero point and how it rubs against your own nature. It doesn’t come from a script magically changing your own aura or energy for fleeting time period, or doing a kind of reverse shallow Hal on someone else.

The title of the sub is Heartsong, and in true Zero Point style is has to work with your own inner nature or zero point. In this case it is your own heart, your sense of how you love or how you feel attraction, that is going to affect the type of person you will attract. You don’t really have to do anything (nor does the sub) other than recognizing your own inner nature, especially your desire nature, your love nature (Venus, Mars, Moon etc in natal chart) and become comfortable with them, and allow them to bloom and express outwardly, to “sing” and attract someone for whom that nature is going to give them a good feeling.

But once you’ve attracted them, that doesn’t mean they’re going to stay unless you consciously work to maintain that connection, and I think really this is what HeartSong is designed to do is to remind the subconscious to continue to keep these aspects of your being active, and then the action you take does the rest.

It’s easy to over-complicate love because its one of the most profound things a person can feel, indeed Christianity has been based on the Master making it clear just how important love is, whether it is romantic love or brotherly love or some other kind of love. It is a life’s work, learning how to use your own inner nature and your consciousness to harmonise with others, and to harmonise with the outer world in general. Heartsong just asks you “how do I experience my ideal romantic relationship”, and that causes a lot of recon because often people don’t even know what that is to them, because of past experiences getting in the way of feeling their own inner being.

But yeah, I would steer well clear of the idea of HS making someone else “do something” or “have experience X”, because free will scripting aside, these are really just wishes or desires that are personal and might have nothing to do with what someone else wants in a partner. Use those insights about your own nature to feel in to what your own perfect relationship is like, internally, because by experiencing that internally, you’re working with the natural principles of manifestation to draw that type of experience to you.

I think that’s the kind of ideas I’d love to see focused on in HS. In that way, it draws from some of the insights learned through LB/LBFH, the Primal series, and ME.

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I’m sure this has been mentioned already in the thread, but scripting designed to break patterns that lead to difficult relationship dynamics would be great.

In high school and college I ended up involved with girls with boyfriends, and they’d subsequently relationship hop to me. Needless to say, they never received the space to process/heal/mourn their relationship prior to me, and eventually I’d receive the karmic end of what I initiated in the first place.

I’ve avoided relationships for years now (perhaps out of an emotional trauma from those younger days) and I’d love to jump back in without a subconscious fear of attracting an outdated dynamic.

It wouldn’t have to be healing heavy - just enough to lightly target romantic trauma and/or habits.

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Documenting my mind

Even the idea of being in a relationship right now already brings back the belief that relationships are something I’ll be “trapped in”

I’m trying to remind myself that I’m allowed to break up with anyone if it truly doesn’t work out, so that I’m not trapped.

I don’t truly know how to utilize the fact that I love someone and the fact that they want to be in a great relationship with me to think about how to actually utilize it and create a better life with it…

If I was going to create a great life with anyone, it’s very likely I could do so with her, but deep down the idea that I have is that I give in relationships way more than I get.

I want to be monogamous but childhood upbringing + past experiences lead me to a fear of being controlled and held hostage

These are very conscious and lucid thoughts I’m working through but thought it would be helpful to share

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Oh noes I’ve been called out. You’re right though, bad wording. This is more what I mean (pulled from current Heartsong page):

This is coupled with the sophisticated scripting of Heartsong, which facilitates an immediate, magnetic attraction to those who are a match for you. Remember, this attraction is mutual, creating a powerful, synergistic effect that accelerates the journey to find remarkable romantic partners.

So basically, assuming both parties do/would genuinely connect on a deep level, both parties will feel it instead of just one.

Also, I don’t think “making” someone have an experience is necessarily negative if it’s an enjoyable one, one that makes life feel richer and more exciting to them, even if only subtly.

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Saint and Fire are masters with words and language. See how they’ve used the word ‘facilitate’. That means:

To facilitate means to make an action, process, or task easier, smoother, or more likely to happen. [1]

That means it assists in improving the probability of an outcome, but it does not cause it. The other party who isn’t necessarily using the subliminal could say “get away from me you freak!”, but they might not either.

The copy talks about basically doing what can be done to remove impediments to the process. Not making it happen. Kind of along the lines of “you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make it drink”. One does not shove the horses head in the river and say “Drink Artax! Drink!” :laughing:

And by all means if it’s consensual, “you made me… ‘have an experience’, Daddy!” :laughing: but in all reality as men we don’t cause a woman to do anything, she makes the decision to go along with the process and gets herself excited. We only facilitate :wink: and vice versa for other gender configurations of course.

Of course, if she’s into leather and wearing a collar and having things “done” to her, have at it, but then that would be Primal Nights, not Heartsong :rofl:

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I notice how that on WDB (and ever since running WDB), I pull women in with emotional connection and make the vibe more “romantic,”

REPEATEDLY, I MEAN RE-PETE-DAVIDSON-DIDDLY I hear women tell me “I can have casual sex if that’s what I want no problem but when it’s something real and emotional like this that’s hard for me”

And then their attachment issues come up

So, scripting around being a person that people can feel securely attached to could be helpful in heartsong.

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A crazy idea: If you could rank every potential partner in the world purely by compatibility, the person ranked first—the most compatible person among everyone alive—could be considered your soulmate. By this definition, a soulmate isn’t mystical; it’s simply the person with whom you have the highest possible compatibility.

However, there may be thousands or even millions of highly compatible people in the world. Only a small fraction of them would actually add value to your life because of practical factors such as living nearby, being available, crossing paths with you, and having the opportunity to meet.

Now imagine using subliminals over a long period with the goal of finding the person ranked #1—the most compatible person possible. Perhaps that could take ten years. But reaching someone ranked between #50 and #1,000 might be achievable within a year.

The interesting part is that the actual difference in compatibility between the person ranked #1 and someone ranked #100,000 may be incredibly small—perhaps only 0.001%. Yet that tiny difference could theoretically require years of additional effort to achieve.

That is how I think about subliminals: not as something that magically creates a soulmate, but as a long-term optimization process that gradually increases the probability of encountering increasingly compatible partners.

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UPDATE: Development for Heartsong is going well. I must say, the feedback and ideas on this thread were quite helpful. If New Heartsong is successful (and I am confident that it will be), everyone who contributed should applaud each other.

EDIT: There is still time to submit ideas.

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Damn, my question is: can Heartsong manifest multiple lovers/partners we’d deeply connect with/admire, but with no intention of being monogamous unless we choose to? Like multiple lovers just for hanging out/sex? Maybe with conscious guidance, or maybe that’s just Wanted series territory.

One thing I think will be strong for Heartsong is development of a clearer FILTER for the qualities we want in a partner (which I’ve already kinda said earlier), like during convo from an approach or however we meet a potential partner, we’re really looking at them, listening, “feeling” them, feeling if they’re compatible/have the qualities we connect with/admire etc. Seriously though, to me that seems like one of the strongest (or THE strongest) remedies for neediness. The “do I like her?” frame vs “does she like me?” frame.

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Heartsong places no limitations on the nature of the relationships you create. If that is the goal, the script itself will not contradict this. However, given the nature of the title, there are probably better titles in terms of manifestation itself. What Heartsong will do is help you understand yourself, your needs and connect to potential romantic partners overall in a meaningful way, which still helps in multi-partner relationships. Overall, romantic relationships of all kinds should go smoother, with all partners feeling satisfied, fulfilled and connected.

Scripting for this in included in Stage 1. Yes, it has been decided that Heartsong is becoming a two stage system. Not quite ready to discuss everything yet, but thematically, consider Stage 1 as “Heartsong: Reforged,” and Stage 2 as the manifestation engine, or the stage that is most similar to OG Heartsong.

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I like the idea of stage one being more like a reforge experience and less like a stabilizer experience because with Ascension am extremely conflicted… I’d ultimately love to run both ST1 & 2 because I see how important they are and how they both synergize, and while the stabilizer was extremely helpful for me… I noticed that a month wasn’t quite long enough of a run, which made me feel the need to run ST1 and ST2.

With reforge, on the other hand, it feels like a more complete experience… my results will be internal when they need to be an external when they need to be, decided on by my subconscious mind, not by my conscious mind (which hates delayed gratification)

I hope that stage one really is like reforged that if you wanted to you could just run it indefinitely, “manifest from within” kind of vibes

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Alright @SaintSovereign, I never actually answered your earlier question about what a successful Heartsong run would look like to me, so here goes:

Six months in, I’d want my romantic life to be materially different in the real world. Let’s assume we’re talking more than just “I’m in my ideal long-term relationship after running HS for six months”—that’s what I’d truly want as the end goal. But what about the process that has happened before that, or if that hasn’t happened yet?

I’m meeting significantly more women who are genuinely compatible with me. Dating apps are producing better matches and more dates. Women are discovering me naturally online/socially. Friends are introducing me to people they think I’d click with. I’m getting invited into environments where compatible women are present. I’m more driven to actually go out, explore, accept invitations, initiate, and create pathways instead of simply hoping somebody appears.

There should be a sense of romantic abundance: not indiscriminate volume, but enough genuinely compatible possibilities that I’m not putting enormous pressure on one person or one ambiguous connection.

I’d also want much stronger relationship-form discernment. I can tell the difference between someone who is simply attractive, someone I have great sexual chemistry with, someone who could make a wonderful friend or FWB, someone worth dating for a period, and someone with serious long-term partnership potential.

I don’t think every successful connection needs to be pushed toward one predetermined “soulmate” endpoint. Ideally Heartsong helps each reciprocal connection develop into the form that actually works best for both people. If I consciously want a long-term partner, then absolutely help me find and build that relationship—but other meaningful connections along the way shouldn’t automatically be treated as failures.

I’m better at recognizing mutual interest, flirting, initiating, asking women out, escalating when clearly reciprocated, communicating attraction, discussing sex and boundaries, and talking honestly about what kind of relationship we both want.

And once I’m actually in a relationship, Heartsong helps with the unsexy-but-critical stuff too: secure attachment, trust, communication, conflict repair, maintaining attraction, affection, sex, independence, shared experiences, and building a life that makes both people better rather than smaller.

So I think my simplest definition would be:

A successful Heartsong run gives me more compatible romantic opportunities, makes me much better at recognizing and acting on them, helps me develop each reciprocal connection into its best mutually desired form, and ultimately makes my romantic life abundant, secure, intimate, exciting, and actually moving somewhere.

That’s what I’d personally want to be able to look back on after six months and say: “Okay, Heartsong clearly worked.”

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Yes, that is the idea. The two stages can be run sequentially and one will benefit greatly by doing so, but each stage is essentially its own title. And both stages, when stacked with another romance title, will produce very interesting results.

Stage 1 in particular should enhance future runs of any romance title, as well as increase the skills you’ve already developed.

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Hold on a minute, please. Is Heartsong becoming a 2 stager? I must have missed that announcement.

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Good ideas here:

We concur. This is directly addressed in both stages.

Directly addressed in Stage 1. Stage 2 has elements of this as well.

Addressed in both stages.

From the qOS notes regarding New Heartsong:

The early version of Polyglot was codenamed “Human Connection.” Much of the non-language scripting from that build made it into the various stages of New Heartsong, and that’s what gives this title its status as a “unique” romance title. One of the main skills being developed is mastery of “relationship” itself. By this, we don’t mean controlling another. Instead, we’re dealing with the act of relating: the way you meet another person, and before that, the way you meet yourself.

Relating is something you do, not something you have. It can be learned, and most of us learned it by accident, from whoever was around when we were small and then from whoever we happened to date.

New Heartsong treats it as a craft in its own right: knowing what you actually need and how much of it you can supply yourself, saying what you want plainly and surviving the answer, seeing the person in front of you instead of the picture you brought, repairing after a fight, staying yourself inside a commitment. None of that requires anyone else to change. All of it changes what happens between you and everyone you’re close to.

That’s the “Human Connection” inheritance. In Polyglot, that scripting helped you hear the meaning underneath someone’s words and find the shared ground beneath a foreign language. In Heartsong it’s pointed at the one language nobody is fluent in on the first try: another person.

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It is.

I mentioned this before: when we made C&C, my intuition was screaming at me that it needed to be a four stager. I posed the question to the community and single stage won out (BY FAR) and I went with it. Then the “C&C debacle” occurred, which ended exactly as we predicted – people are now thriving on it, but given the difficulty of the title, it took a very long time for the value to truly emerge.

The same intuitive ping has occurred with Heartsong. It needs to be two stages.

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