Can you show your vulnerability to woman without losing attraction?

Questions and Comments
#1

Hi guys and gals…
I want to confront a believe I am having…I dont know if it is healthy…
From the redpill knowledge I heared that showing your vulnerability to woman is a big issue. That this instantly spark hypergamy in them and makes them loose sexual attraction…because of that I have been trying to put on that fassade of having everything in order.
But its so overextending to keep that up.

My exwife made fun of me when I cried. My ex gf put in hooks and abused my moments of weakness for her benefits. When I let my boundaries down.

I have been trying so hard to get rid of all my weaknesses but its simply impossible. I am a human beeing, i have the scars of my past, i dont want to fight and repress my human condition anymore…a part lf me tells me I am doomed to never be attractive with all those “weaknesses”, my excentric nature, my sensitivity, my geekness, my moments of sadness, grief and pain… I myself have come to accept and love those parts…as those are providing so much wisdom to me.

But is it truly like that? Or is it just the shame about the weakness that is unattractive?
Or is it all about cooking myself in the crucible, over and over again, till im wholely covered in hard skin and have that as my protection…only keeping my weakness and soft inner nature for myself, not letting anyone get to that part…and nourish myself completley from the inside…

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#2

That is psychopathic. I’m so sorry to hear about what you went through in your past relationships.

Embrace your weaknesses.
If you are ashamed of them, embrace the shame too.
It’s a part of you. Then learn how to increase your attractiveness with what you have.

If you find a girl who thinks you’re unattractive by having weaknesses (a.k.a. being a human), then bid them good luck finding a perfect god elsewhere.

I won’t say that showing less/more vulnerability will increase/decrease your attractiveness.
Every guy is different, every girl is different. But if your goal is to be in a relationship, hiding your vulnerabilities is a dangerous spiral to go into. Find the balance that works for you.

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#3

One good rule to know: never show your vulnerability to someone could weaponize it against you later. In my perspective, there are only a few people you can show it to: your mother or father, your best male friends (your ride or dies), and your therapist.
A woman will listen to you, and when you fight the next time, she’ll weaponize that information and throw it back in your face.

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#4

I’m sorry to hear about that, brother. You’re not alone in that. @ksub is right. As cruel is it might seem, crying is rarely beneficial. Your partner will just not see you the same. Only few times where it doesn’t backfire is when its one of those stereotypical macho man. You get a few vulnerability and crying cards every now and then, and its a long gap between now and then.

Leave the vulnerability to your therapist, parents and male friends, or whatever men group if your into that.

You have to open your eyes to them and see them as they truly are – they’re not your mother, even your mother could get sick of it at some point but might not tell you. Weakness is unattractive, unless when its to show that “hey, I may be a Commando who cracked skulls, dug graves, climbed off the Berlin wall while under fire, survived under trenches away from enemy sight for three months, parachuted behind enemy lines, saved a baby with just a Swiss knife with barely a broken nail; but I am human and i deserve to be loved” Absurd, I know; but that’s just how it is. Oh, and only one manly tear allowed lol.

You might find a few rare apples here in there, but you know, genes and all are still there.

I say F* it all to hell; Bottling up all these emotions and pretending to be this super hero that is made of marble is just a recipe for disaster and is the birth of all those atrocities. Those emotions that in many cultrures are not supposed to be expressed, where a child is stripped off them, gives birth to all that abusive spirit towards the other gender and towards themselves.

Find your balance and channel those energies within yourself; express them into something else.

Remember, you do not want to be seen as a child who is in need of protection - crying will just bring up that caring instinct within them, its beautiful in its way, but it also brings up that question of whether this dude is worthy of breeding. You do not want to be seen as one of her GFs as well. Women will test your manhood in the slightest and subtlest of ways.

It is not my intent to paint them as horrible creatures if that is the color of my chosen words, one cannot blame nature for making tomatoes red, or oranges orange, is just is and it chose so for good reasons of its own.

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#5

Thank you.

So it is the crucible until I have a hard shell. It feels really relieving to finally see that truth.

#6

It all depends in what kind of world you live.

If you run Emperor, Khan…or any other “Direct masculine alpha” subs those "human weaknesses which you talked aabout will subside eventually. So you won’t be vulnerable and you will most likely attract submissive women. Which you’ll most likely chase. But it’s a challenging route and from your explanation seems like you can’t run alpha subs for long.

The other choice is the Wanted line of products or Heartsong.
WB is “indirect masculine alpha” (I don’t know it I can call it alpha or not, but it’s passive aand indirect) but Wanted is about being someone who accepts his flaws (rings a bell?) The archetype that you become on this sub is similar to the women you attract on direct alpha subs which were mentioned above. Which they will chase you. On Wanted line and Khan line which are polarizing and two counterparts of each other, it’s hard to pursue a career. As in one is too exalted(Khan), the other is low life(indulging in your desires, not giving a damn about anything and living in pleasure…) enough with the philosophy.

The only one who I think you can be genuinly “vulnerable” with is the one who you attract with heartsong. But my only vulnerability in this life are my secret about subclub. These subs are just superpowers and each title can change ones life UPSIDE DOWN.
So I recommend not telling anyone about subliminals, cuz they will get more competent and it will be harder for you to excel socially. Even to a heartsong soul mate.

Or you caan run emperor or emperor black for some time and become exalted and get rid of those weak points. If you run alpha subs for some time you won’t cry, you will address the problem through action. On WANTED line you will share it, but in IDGAF and “I accept my flaws” manner, so that ain’t vulnerability actually.

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#8

The “prize” memtality is mainly predominant between lovers who gets attracted while running the WANTED line.
The fact that someone see you as a “prize” is product of psychological manipulation/seduction…through coquetry, push pull… which is rooted in our animal nature.

IMO heartsong trascends that and people connect on humane level. Not that Khan or WB are not linked to humane nature. But titles such as love bomb, chosen, heartsong mostly activates the human parts of us, the parts which were developed when survival was less and less of a concern. Whole spirituality was developed after the mountains prevented from outside attacks, so people started going inside.

IMO the most “Animal nature” title is Emperor Black.

But it’s not that black and white, reptilian, mamalian and Neocortex are connnnevted with each other. The fact that one understand EB’s script is because of the Neocortex.

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#9

I think it could be best to have both your “animal / primal” side and also the deeper connection to be in good place. Both exist within us all.

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#10

If a woman ever does this to you, draw a hard boundary that you won’t accept it, and if it happens again, you leave.

Not all women are psychotic manipulators, the same way not all men are rapists.

We have to become better partners, then choose better partners.

A week or two ago I broke down and sobbed on the phone to my current girlfriend, and the way she treats me hasn’t changed. However, I’m not stupid, yes I’ve been on the look out to see if she has treated me differently in any way. I will say that after that there have been slightly more shit tests, but I’ve maintained frame and everything is still going smoothly.

If she ever tries to use it against me, I’ll do what I said above, draw my boundary and stick to it. That’s the only thing one can do. Walking around distrustful of sharing your full self with the world, and particularly your partner, sounds miserable.

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#11

Edit: actually nvm, I’ll give/repost this advice once I’ve gotten a few beautiful women in a dating rotation.

#12

I’ve been there my friend and what I discovered is that it 100%%%%%% depends on the woman.

Some will abuse it. Sone will love the openness and love your more. Sone are indifferent.

Therefore the only logical conclusion is: what kind of a man do YOU want to be?

Then be that.

If your current woman can’t handle it, find one that can.

It’s that simple.

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#13

Thank you for that beautiful summary of the different archetypes.
I actually ran the khan journey for 4 months, it was amazing, especially while I was in a relationship.

Stopped it to build a more solid foundation regarding self love.

Reading what you write, the khan line suits me way better with my current goal than the wanted line…atleast for now. As there are issues in my life to be fixed and i need to learn to assert myself more strongly onto the world…

Wonder how Khan would stack with the alchemist journey I am currently embarking.

#14

It depends.

If you show your weakness as in “I have those problems and I’m facing them everyday to get better” most women will respect you more. The ones who don’t are retarded and you should ban from your life.

Now, if you show your weakness as “I have those problems and that’s the reason why I’m so weak! please feel sorry for me!!!” then I have bad news for you

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#15

I completely agree with @alexandergraves

I’ve met my fiancee in a coaching training.
We were both very open about everything. Problems, challenges, traumas, whatever.
I cried tons of times in these last three years in her presence.
It only gave more depth to our relationship.

And yes, when I hurt her with my porn addiction and with lying about it, she sometimes used it against me. All her pain just used whatever it could to defend herself.
She’s not perfect. Just as I am not perfect.

But in the long run it doesn’t really matter.

We are deeply in Love :two_hearts:

Together we outgrow our old limitations.

It’s just a matter of finding the right woman.
With the right woman you can experience the same thing.
If you really want to experience a deep change, run Heartsong. Heal everything stopping you from finding the one.
Find her. Make her yours.
Knowing that the path isn’t easy.
But rewarding.
And healing.

With the right woman you can get it solved quicker then alone. She’s like a mirror. Poking her fingers right where it hurts. But that’s not to hurt you (perhaps superficially in the moment). In the bigger picture it’s for you to realize your shortcomings and grow as a man.

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#16

Wonderful comment
Thank you!

Yes, this is what i actually want…

The thing I am nkt sure yet, is how to find the way there…the book the rational male says that it is utmost important to “spin plates” aka, have a pool to choose from and experience abundance once before you settle with one. I dont know if i can skip that step…as my game is not really there yet…some practice would be definitely good.

This whole day brought me a lot though. I see that its time to step up in my life now, and keep myself more responsible :heavy_plus_sign::heavy_plus_sign::heavy_plus_sign:

#17

“knowledge”

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#18

Thank you for challenging me :pray:

#19

Yup just like everything else in red pill horse shit, it’s a lie buried within a sleeve of truth.

If you want to win with women, you need to be a man.

For a man to express vulnerability, it must be done from a masculine position, that’s all.

Women are naturally repulsed by powerlessness. For obvious reasons, because it signals that you can’t protect or care for them.

When you cry, cry from a position of being powerful and in touch with your emotions.

There is only one true rule that all men must strive to live by: never be “powerless.”

Because you’re not powerless, and you never are and you never were powerless and you never will be.

At your weakest moments, there is always something you can do. That’s power.

So long as you radiate ambition, and resilience and power: no matter how fucked your life is, you can cry and it’ll only make her love you more.

As with everything else I say here, I’ve done it, that’s why I believe it.

I’ve cried around girls and then we had sex after. It’s a beautiful experience tbh. Hell, actually crying sex is kinda dope. :sweat_smile::rofl:

But yeah.

Build power, ambition, resilience. Be a man, and you can express your emotions and it will only make women love you more.

Express emotions from a position of powerlessness and hopelessness, and you’ll be repulsive.

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#20

Also no, it’s about shedding the skin. You’re weakness is not you. Your trauma is not you. You’re thoughts aren’t you. You don’t need to harden yourself. You need to soften. Become water, one of the most powerful things in nature.

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#21

To me, this looks like the problem.

The question is framed sub-optimally.

Instead of trying to get rid of your weaknesses; work hard to locate your strengths.

Even the Sun itself is sometimes hidden from our sight. With each setting, it is ‘defeated’ (‘weakness’), and if you like you can laugh at it throughout the whole night.

But when the dawn comes, and the Sun recovers from its ‘weakening’ and returns from its so-called ‘defeat’, you will stop laughing. And you will respect.

One of the essences of masculinity in my view is about finding your own edges, your own personal areas of challenge, pioneering, and risk, and then walking into the storm to face them. For your own reasons. On your own terms.

For some people, this may involve picking up a ball and running as hard and as fast as you can. For some, it may mean pushing the envelope of their understanding of science and medicine. For others, it is walking into the maelstrom of emotional honesty and the shadow, again and again.

In each case, you will get knocked down. Then you will get up and say ‘eff it’, and keep going.

Don’t do that for her, or for me, or for your friends. Don’t even do it for you. Do it for the path. For the honor of it.

Learn.

Take a risk.

Fuck up.

Regroup.

Grow.

Rinse and Repeat.

Sounds like you were hurt and embarrassed and humiliated. That sucks. And it’s not ‘your fault’. But since these are your feelings, they are your responsibility.

Now what do you think is your job to do?

To react like a child or like an adult?

(The answer is probably, Both.)

Make friends with your emotions. Including shame, embarrassment, fear, worry. Own them as ‘Your People’. Ultimately, they are within you and are not ‘created’ by anyone else. As hard as it may be to believe, you are actually incredibly lucky to have them. Even the painful ones. So face them. Get to know your emotions. And over time, fewer and fewer people will be able to use them to control you.

Right now, you are afraid of embarrassment. You are afraid of shame. You are afraid of fear. That’s why you are afraid of people who can inspire those in you. If you change your relationship to those emotions, then you divest those people of their power over you.

What if she could laugh at you, and that didn’t break you?

Picture that.

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