Washout setbacks

[TheRock]

I’m running subs for a year now. I follow the recommended listening pattern, with washouts every 21 days. On washout, I always fall back in my old thinking and behavior patterns and low status mode I was operating during the last 40+ years. Also, I ALWAYS have fights with my wife during washouts. I think it has to do with the before mentioned “low” state of mine. I never felt a bloom during washout, only “lows”. Is anybody experiencing the same, and if so, what do you do to prevent it?

This cycle I will use micro loops, starting with 30 secs, trying to find my sweet spot. Maybe that helps, integrating the subs more into my subconscious.

[Leandros]

I woud try to comand yourself for permanent change.

And then meditate into it.

Like : I want that the changes are permanent, so I allow the changes to be permanently in me

Its just a thought of mine, I didn’t test it, but that’s what I woud do.

[TheRock]

Very good idea. Will try it out!

[Phoenix]

The switch to the life you wanted isn’t quick.

The change often times includes the memories from the past for you to confirm. Just acknowledge them, maybe also you are ignoring them (fighting the old self doesn’t make the old you to go away). You need to contemplate on what makes you have an argument with your wife. In a relationship we don’t need to be always right or boss all the time, we need to give time for our special someone to express themselves too.

The comfort zone is like that, always having some old experienced but when you get to pass that part the next level would be awesome.

[Lion]

How long is the washout?

You can try a washout of 3 days instesd of 5 especially if your stack remains the same.

Also, going into old habits during a washout isn’t something to be worried about. We also do it during reconciliation in the middle of a cycle.

Also, look into starting a consistent meditation practice. It will not only boost your results but will lengthen your reaction time to your thoughts and feelings, and hence make you a more calm, collected person and help you keep a high state of mind.

One big reason why Malkuth comes across as a personable fellow on the forum is due to his one hour a day meditation routine. But even 15 to 20 minutes a day is enough to keep your head above the muddy waters of dark thoughts and emotions.

I have experienced a change in my state of mind just after a week of meditating for 15 minutes everyday for a week. The change is astounding and you will think you have always been that way. It’s hilarious in some ways.

[Fractal_Explorer]

Hi! You might find this helpful

Support Ticket Questions & Answers

Might help someone out when using micro loops. I’ll be adjusting my rest times after cycles moving forward. Hi, I find that ever since running microloops they have a sort of stabilizing effect on me. But I still struggle a lot with the 5 days of rest after a 21 day cycle. It sometimes feels a little too long and I slip into old habits. Is there anything I can do during those 5 days or possibly cut it down to something shorter? For context I’m running 1 minute loops at the moment. Hello Th…

I experience this too. Micro loops are the way and rest days when needed vs a rigid schedule for me. I am somewhat of an experimenter out of necessity. I’ve found too long without sub exposure is counterproductive for me. I’ve had some of my worst episodes on extended washouts. I think because for me at least these subs have a stabilizing effect while the deeper change is occuring. Definitely no blooms for me either.

[TheRock]

Thank you @Fractal_Explorer and @Lion. Your answers help me. I think I will cut back the washout next time if I observe after 3 or 4 days that the processing is done. Also thinking about meditation. It will be hard to accomodate in my schedule, but I will try

@Fractal_Explorer

I’ve found too long without sub exposure is counterproductive for me. I’ve had some of my worst episodes on extended washouts.

Same with me!

@Phoenix

@Phoenix

You need to contemplate on what makes you have an argument with your wife.

You’re right, I have to observe it and I’m guessing that it is something inside me, that triggers that responses from my wife.

@Phoenix

In a relationship we don’t need to be always right or boss all the time, we need to give time for our special someone to express themselves too.

That’s true. But on washout she wants to be true all the time and boss me around, I don’t like that, what causes the problems…

[WorldOvertaker]

I’ve had a nice breakthrough of results when I did 2 cycles back to back, skipping the washout

[Jouissance]

you might actually be stonewalling a bit during your cycle and then blooming (including getting recon) during the washouts.

what if you tried reducing your listening times in the second half of your cycle.

Listen to 15 mins the first half but listen to 7 mins the second half, and then see what that does with your washouts.

I think reducing your washouts to 3-4 days is much less approved of, and while it’s a viable experiment, shouldn’t be the FIRST thing you try, compared to the tried and true “reduce listening time when getting recon”

[Risky]

To me, Washout is when I get the most recon and I suspect it’s because processing queue is super full that there might not be room for processing and it all gets done in the washout.

I don’t think it’s stonewalling because I still feel recon throughout the cycle. But the recon is most intense during washout.

Probably cut down on loops.

Also, what do you mean by reverting to low behaviour? Perhaps it’s just recon, and recon is be definition a tough state to be in, negative emotions, stress, agitation and so on. Is this what you mean?

[gerard]

Meditation improved the observer in me for these boss me moments personally.
Reducing my reactions.

Then recently Primal Romance revolutionised them as I called them out…for what they were bullying, controlling attempts whilst also adding renewed early days Romance back!

[Jouissance]

@Risky

To me, Washout is when I get the most recon and I suspect it’s because processing queue is super full that there might not be room for processing and it all gets done in the washout.

I don’t think it’s stonewalling because I still feel recon throughout the cycle. But the recon is most intense during washout.

yeah you’re probably right. not stonewalling during the cycle, but intense processing once the washout starts.

Still suggests that you should drop loop time to allow yourself some room to process more during the 21 day cycle @TheRock

[TheRock]

@Risky

Also, what do you mean by reverting to low behaviour?

Before I used subs it was normal for me to think bad about myself, had low self-esteem, low status, etc. That I call my “low” state. When I listen to subs that feelings are reverted. I’m in a “high” state where I’m in a good mood, think good about myself and have in higher status. On washout I mostly fall back to that “low” state of mine.

[Risky]

Okay, could it be recon as mentioned earlier? Because that kinda brings one low states and coping behaviours because of said low states, like coping with stress, anxiety and change?

Anyway, my view is its normal and part of growth. If it’s too much lower exposure I guess. But I personally wouldn’t call it reverted.

Because emotions come and go, up and down.

I hate recon because it’s tough. But I also love it because of the massive growth potential. It’s like a good leg day. Lol

[TheRock]

Thanks everyone for the ideas! Here’s the summary: This might just be recon, a normal part of the process. Technically, I could shorten washouts to 3 or 4 days (keeping the stack the same), try microloops, or listen less at the end of the cycle. Meditation might help me absorb and process the subliminal better.

Here’s the plan: I’ll keep going with the microloops I started this cycle and try to find my sweet spot. I’ll also try to fit some meditation into my routine.

If I still have those “lows” during washout after trying microloops, I’ll shorten the washout to 3 or 4 days when I feel a “low” coming on. I might even try @WorldOvertaker’s suggestion and skip a washout altogether.

[Phoenix]

Both of you is on stage 2 of a relationship.

This is where the difficulty begins and you start to notice each others imperfection, argue about even the smallest most trivial things.

You already experienced the effect, some may even feel dishearten and consider giving up however this stage can be overcome if both partners are willing to work through the issues together.

It’s in this stage that the foundation of understanding begins to form.

[MechaShaman]

Hi friend!
I know what you are describing. This changed for me quite massivley when I started to listen to the subs on a low volume isntead of quite loud…Just so that I could hear it.

The other thing that I recognize…When you are in that low state…go to your journal. And jsut write down what you are feeling. Write all those bad lowstate feelings out. And at one point you may have are revalation…Just write…I am angry. I am sad. I feel frustrated. I feel lonely…whatever. Starting to do this changed my life massively.

I feel like this dropping out of the sub and into negativity is when there are unresolved feelings. I go to my mamalian brain where the fight/flight/fawn/freeze response lives and where negativity is. And the old self. The subliminals life in the Higher brain…but we cant get access to it when there are feelings on the surface.
Also regarding your wife. I feel like see is sensing energetically that you arent in your power anymore and doesnt feel safe. It should become better as soon as you try to find a way to journal your feelings out.

The meditation will definitley help aswell.

Hope this helps Bro!

[MechaShaman]

Also, as I listen a bit rarer than the recommended listening recommendation:
In those time of recon…its really time to make the changes. After 4 days of not listening to the subliminals…I have the impulses of again watching some youtube or series…but everytime it comes up…I know…that if I change it now, it will be permanent. During the heavy listening, the sub is like a clothing for me…but during the washout, its about integrating the subs into my being. To really make the permanent changes. Its been hard, but this is the real work. These are the real small changes that add up.