Blue’s Subliminal Journey


Good question. I will be sure to give Primal a go when its out. Otherwise its quite simple. S&S, for me , is basically hit or miss at the moment. Im sure that with enough exposure i might have gotten great results. Thing is i dont like the ups and downs.

With Ascended Mogul its slow and steady and while its slow, im also getting somewhere. And honestly, not getting laid is far better than being despirate.

From my limited experiance i am certain of this. There are women who truly like me, those who are neutral and those who dislike me.

With those who like me its efortless and nothing but amazing

With the neutral ones, who happen to be the majority, they need to be seduced in a way that i simply can not do for the life of me. Just being me isnt going to cut it with them. And trying to be someone else is dangerious. Honestly trying to seduce them is like trying to speak a completly new forgin language.

Those who dislike me… well they dont even exist on my map because its probably mutual.

I am not a natural seducer but i can talk to women, show intrest, lead and make a move. This seems to only work on those who truly like me. With the more or less intrested its just luck, and is often more harmful than rewarding.

Edit: Its honestly very simple. I was just over complicating things. Getting women is easy once your beliefes and actions are in the right place.

Where is that right place for me? I dont know for the moment. Its that click that when it happens, everything falls into place. It hasnt clicked for me yet.


Women do the choosing. You’ll save yourself a lot of time by only going for the girls that choose you that you’re attracted to them.

As you improve, the quality of women attracted to you will improve.


That sounds reasonable @Ace

However, to test that premise:

  1. How do you know for sure?

  2. So Attraction cannot be created at all?

  3. Then the only thing we can control is our SMV. We present it to the girl, and she will either go for it or not? Then “Seduction” doesn’t exist?

  4. Why can’t men choose? Women make themselves pretty to advertise themselves to the men around, and men approach them. If women were the choosers, then why do they advertise themselves in a “broadcast” way, while men go directly to a “target”? That seems to me like the men choose while women signal availability to all men around.


Because to me women being the choosers is disempowering. It makes me feel a lack of control.

A much better belief that can let a man take more chances, more risks, is to assume all women are attracted to you, and you are the one to choose the girl you want.

It’s the safer more rewarding route.

Because then, if women are choosers, and you believe you are the chooser, you lose nothing.

But if it turns out men are the choosers, then you took more action than other men and got more results, rather than waited for the girl to lay down the red carpet for you and flash green light after green light for you to make your move.

Also, this might go against the theory you read, but many women have no idea how to flirt and don’t know how to signal their interest to a guy overtly. All they do is follow your lead. So you cannot know those women like you until you choose them and lead them.

Especially in Eastern Europe / Russia. They told me repeatedly it’s not appropriate for the girl to show interest in the guy, and they don’t. They don’t initiate or send IOIs. But what they do is they either follow your lead or not. If they follow your lead, although there are no clear IOIs, it is on. If they don’t follow your lead, it either means “not now” or “No”.

Either way, choosing, leading, escalating, putting your balls on the line rather than waiting for some girl to choose you. That’s the way of men. To take risks and risk rejection, not wait for a “sure thing”.

Just my views, I believe this is a more empowering and masculine view.

However, @Ace I am totally open to changing my mind. What first-hand proof did you experience that let you think what I am saying here now is incorrect, and that women must show interest and choose the guy first?

  1. I didn’t make this up. Look at nature. In the vast majority of species, the females choose.

  2. I never said attraction couldn’t be created. I said he would save a lot of time by going after those girls that choose you.

  3. Ultimately all we can control is what we do. Take action. Initiate conversation and see where it goes. Of course seduction exist. But what is seduction really? In these modern times, it is creating the space for a woman to be comfortable and relax into her own sexual feelings.

  4. You can choose who you approach, but a woman has to choose you to allow you to have sex with her.

You choose to make what I said disempowering. You don’t control them. You only control you. Even if you take action, there’s no guarantee that she won’t turn you down, flake, etc…

I’ll give you two empowering beliefs I have, even after years of marriage. Are they true, who knows, but it’s how I show up in the world:

  1. My dick is worth more than her pussy. This isn’t to say men are more valuable than women. I don’t believe that. We each bring different strengths and weaknesses to a relationship. Still, I understand that I bring a lot to any relationship. So just because a women is beautiful to look at, I don’t lose my shit, because beauty changes over time. Who I am, gets better with time and the results of my actions increase exponentially. Women can tell this when they interact with me, and I have even had other men comment on how women interacted with me, because it was so different. Ultimately, I know that choosing me is the best thing a women can do. I’m going to make her life better in a myriad of ways.

  2. I am a lion. I only deal with lionesses. Lions do very little. Their ultimate value is in their ability to defend the pride and protect the cubs from others. The lionesses go out and hunt etc. My strength is my character. Do I have a good job? Yes. Do I think I am good looking? Yes. Do I have my own home? Yes. And none of that means anything when relating to a women. My strength of character outshines all of these facts. And I never mention the other stuff. I could lose it all tomorrow and I would get it back in no time. My wife is a lioness. She is fierce, intelligent, willing to go out and hunt and take care of me and the kids. A lioness respects strength. So she is with me because I offer that. Ultimately, this belief gives me a measuring stick for the women I interact with, even before I was married. So I can immediately tell if a women fits what I’m looking for or doesn’t.

I’ve never been to Eastern Europe / Russia, so I can’t speak on that. But I have had very beautiful Russian women in the United States give me clear IOIs. In fact, I was just driving yesterday, and as I turned a corner, an Eastern European woman locked eyes with me and maintained eye contact with me as I turned the corner.


That’s the Aura working :wink:


Thank you. What you said seems very well thought out and convincing.

Swinggcat in his Masculine Polarity product argues that humans are the only species where both men and women are the choosers and the chosen. His argument seems valid. You might want to check it out to see his POV.

However, I cannot disagree with anything you said. You are correct. About Eastern European / Russian women, as @Dmitry would say, they either change when they go abroad because they adapt to the other culture, or something like that. In Russia, they are much more “shy”.

In all cases, this is a personal thing. To me, believing I am both the chooser and the chosen is more empowering than to be the chosen and to reduce my feeling of control. I agree, this might be objectively wrong, but subjectively, it makes my approaches much stronger because I am not approaching while looking for confirmation, but rather “taking what’s mine”.

Because many women have this fantasy of meeting a man who takes what is his, rather than what he is allowed to have:

In the end, we might be really talking about the same exact thing. Just that our definition of words may be different. I believe the core of what we’re talking about is agreement.


If that’s what empowers you, believe it. I’m here for personal growth and if I can shed light on something you or others may be going through, I’m happy to help.

I don’t think the core of what we are talking about is the same. I’ve had a different reality than many men who find themselves consuming PUA material. When I was dating, I was the guy women cheated on their boyfriends for, multiple times. I didn’t judge and I knowingly dealt with women in relationships, so I could just be the “fun sexy” guy. Because of that I had major trust issues and it was difficult to have a healthy relationship.

I found PUA material as I was trying to change this and make a relationship work. As crazy as it seems, many of these works helped me stop being that guy and instead make a long term relationship work. They helped me see what was going on for myself as well as the women I was attracting. Once I understood the social dynamics, I was able to alter how I showed up in the world.

As far as women having the fantasy of meeting a man who takes what is his…Many men had a fantasy of flying before the invention of the airplane, it doesn’t mean they ever flew.

When a woman meets a man who takes what is his, she knows it, and allows herself to be taken. Men think they are seducing, but it is the women who are allowing themselves to be seduced. How so? If you approach a woman and start talking to her, she chooses whether to stay in the conversation or not. She chooses to give you her number or not. She chooses whether to go out on a date or not. She chooses whether to go back to your place.

At each stage of this process, she is giving you a chance not to screw things up. Women can see a man and decide whether he would ever have a shot at being with her. Some men get all green lights from the beginning. Most get a yellow light until they talk themselves into a green light. My advice to @Saiyan4Blue and all men is to go for the girls that he finds attractive and give him a green light from the beginning.


Exactly what i was trying to convey though way more and elegantly elaborated, well said.

By being myself yet actually giving it a go i filter out 80% of women. Yet for those who choose to be seduced. It was amazing in every way.


I think you’re doing the ‘‘GOD gave’’ game with this one. By adding ‘‘GOD gave’’ to everything anyone does, they put GOD above structurally and that’s it for you. You automatically couldn’t have done anything from your free choice, by wanting to help on your own. GOD sent you to do this. And also therefore, you’re not the one to be thanked to for all these gifts, because GOD talked through you.

Your actions are followed by hers. And her actions are followed by you. Only sets of supporting actions by either of you determines the results. Attraction is not a choice. The moment two people get attacted to each other, there’s really no choice. Now you both have to move in a direction you both want and do supporting actions in sets, that allow to get there. Like with smoking, you like the illusion of choice… and some will want to be put below women, when the only thing is that both are side by side.

When attraction kicks in, if she makes her move, and you don’t make yours… either one or both of you does not get what they want.

Edit: I was making myself some food and was thinking, why would people make this ‘‘women choose’’ thing. And my own conclusions are that it helps to feed EGO. If you conclude that women do the choosing, you as a man who said was the guy women cheated on their boyfriends, get to be so validated. They chose you. Yay, you! And now, when you had sex and she cheated on her boyfriend, she chose you over him. Double Yay you. EGO can scream in extasy. :slight_smile:

But for the rest, it leaves people with bad implication. That’s why men act one the fourth or fith thought they have about what to do for her to like them. What to do, for her to choose him. Nature already chose. She already likes you.

Attraction is like a cigarette. That can turn into nicotine addiction. After that we like to think we have a choice. But there’s none. Just actions.


I agree with this 100%.

The difference is I thought you mean we only go for green light girls. I believe that is a restriction. Now that you talk about yellow light, there is a lot of value in talking to girls who are yellow light / moderately interested.


I have no idea what “GOD gave” game is. I haven’t mentioned God nor have I denied free choice.

Attraction isn’t a choice, but consensual sex is. Entering a relationship is. Attraction is just a green light on the road to seduction, if that’s your goal.

It’s not about Ego. It is not about validation. It is about observations made over a lifetime.


I believe it was very easy to understand from the first time I wrote it. You made it literal, which is interesting. It’s what christians use to say that GOD gave something. If you help a christian, instead of really thanking you, he thanks GOD, because he reframes it as GOD was speaking through you. They prayed to GOD and GOD sent you. They put GOD above themselves and others, which allows to connect everything to the GOD.

Shit, I really can’t explain this in two sentences nor in one paragraph. Simple truth is - you can’t choose something, you’ve already chosen. Or more like - nature has chosen for you. It’s like saying ‘‘I really need this’’ when you’ve bought yet another crap in the store. It’s subconscious decision and then finding most rationale text to put in there to explain it was your choice. It wasn’t. Neither was her’s.

As long as you have skills and are seductive to her (which you claimed you also are), it’s not her choice no more. It’s yours. But what you’re saying is more damaging to the other guys who don’t fuck. It’s like - I will tell them a belief I have, which is not THE reason why my seduction works (which is actually being seductive and having skills), but is most definitelly the reason why their’s won’t. Reason why your belief works for you is because you already get pussy and have skills to get it. To be honest, at that point a man can say to himself whatever bullshit he wants or hold weird beliefs and he will still get laid. Not by her decision. It’s by her inability to choose when the only option seems to go further.

Again, I don’t speak about betas. There’s again no choice to say no to them. Have you ever seen woman choose to fuck a beta? Yup, sometimes she does a choosing. It’s when it’s beneficial to her financially and for survival. And she always regrets a choice. It’s the only time she chose, and the same one she had to regret. But she never regrets fucking an Alpha. because fucking an Alpha is not a choice. Everything he does presents ‘‘move forward’’ and that is being explained by ‘‘Oh, I am choosing this’’. We move towards pleasure (interesting, manly) and away from pain (including boring and bland). You can’t chose these. No one has ever chosen nature’s built in mechanism.

I work with advertising. When people say word ‘‘choice’’, I know I got you. I really, really got you. Your whole biology has been used very successfully against you and now you want something subconsciously that you’re going to find a consequence of rationale decision, where you just found something that fits reasonably well to expplain it. But it’s good you said you chose. That means YOU think you are the reason why you think you have what I wanted you to have. And now that’s on you.

Woman fucked with me because I had amazing gloves. At least that’s what I told her for her to be able to rationalize fucking right then and there. I gave her permission slip.

For all the Emperor talk on this forum… I seem to be the only one who actually has an Emperor outlook.


While I don’t work in advertising, my own personal interests in psychology and the workings of the mind have led me to study and test many of the great works on psychology, influence, and marketing. All of that stuff is great, but buying and mating are different.

Choice is not an illusion. People can be influenced. And sure the reptilian brain can make a choice before the frontal cortex, but at any point in a seduction, a guy can do or say something that kills the whole vibe, and the seduction is over. A choice is made that the guy is no longer the potential mate she thought he was.

Your rhetoric regarding choice is bipolar. Either there is choice or there isn’t.

There are many kingdoms to rule and many ways to rule them.


If any of you think she’s the one making the choice, when you have something she has dreamed for the whole sexually capable life and her getting it even just once in her life is one in a billion, you will never fulfill one of her deepest fantasies. It would be throwing your power away, without understanding what kind of power you have. :slight_smile:

Cheers Blue. Sorry for hijacking your thread for a moment.


Its allright @vadc .

There are multiple ways to get attraction.

I have a rich friend who is quirky and he gets laid by playing the gulible nice guy who women think they could use for his money, but he ghosts them after sex.

Another friend who used to be a thug, is a complete natural.

Another one is a so cold nice guy, able to make strong connections with women. Yet he is incapable of feeling love.

  • They are all different but they are quite the same. The rich friend gets them with social proof and status. The gangster gets them with raw sexual attraction. The nice guy gets them with connecting with them emotionally.

There is no ” One way ” to play the game. All three share one thing though. Abundance


I’ve started running Primal 2 days ago and i gotta say im very impressed. Those last 2 days i had a persistant cold and i was unable to leave the house.

Yet the internal changes are nothing but amazing.

  • Im extremly relaxed even though im sick
  • Solid tinder matches


I am very happy for you @Saiyan4Blue

I was wondering, what could be causing the sudden change in Tinder matching?

Is it after the texting that they become solid? Or did you change your pictures?

I was wondering about this on the other thread, whether the effects of Primal and its aura need proximity to manifest, or can work across distance, like in your case with Tinder. If not, it might be just you noticing more of the positives and less of the negatives.

Either way, glad you’ve found girls who like you and will enjoy being with you :slight_smile:


I’ve stopped using dating apps but I’m glad Primal does something for Tinder. I was getting tired of the matches that went nowhere.


Seems like the gist of it. Although with Tinder i’ve found 2 things working.

1: You watch with someone and its 100% on. You dont need perfect game or things to say as long as you are decent. Extremly rare. You might match with one like that once every month.

2: Extremly tweaked profile with great pics, bio and added instagram account to further demonstrate social proof. A friend of mine with profile like that has 90+ matches and 100+ who swiped right to him.

Other than that. Its a numbers game. Most girls are there to have their ego stroked. That goes especially with ones wothout a bio. With them its approach 2 or nothing.